Possession of a Catch.

[Mike]

The WR juggled possession of the ball then gained full possession, was touched by the defender, then the ball was knee'd out of his hands. He was down by contact with the ball in his possession across the endzone. He maintained the catch and was downed by contact. In my mind, there was no contradiction of the rules and the correct call was made.

[Northman]

Originally Posted by Mike

The WR juggled possession of the ball then gained full possession, was touched by the defender, then the ball was knee'd out of his hands. He was down by contact with the ball in his possession across the endzone. He maintained the catch and was downed by contact. In my mind, there was no contradiction of the rules and the correct call was made.

Exactly.

[spikerman]

I can tell you how about the college rule (we use college rules in Texas HS football) and I think it's the same as the NFL. The receiver must control the ball "through the catch". Whether the player is in bounds or out of bounds, the rule is the same. If the player catches the ball and goes to the ground, he must maintain control of the ball until the catch is completed. That is a judgement call by the official, but if the ball is knocked loose by going to the ground, he is not deemed to have maintained control "through the catch".

If a player does not have control of the ball and gains control with any part of his body out of bounds, it is by rule, an incomplete pass.

Last night's call was correct, in my opinion, because the receiver, after initially juggling the ball, gained control, was touched and then the ball was knocked loose by the defender's leg. IMO, even if he hadn't been touched by the defender's hand the call would have been a completed pass, because the act of the defender's leg hitting the receiver's arm is what knocked the ball loose. As soon as that leg touched that arm, the receiver is down by contact.

[missingnumber7]

Originally Posted by spikerman

I can tell you how about the college rule (we use college rules in Texas HS football) and I think it's the same as the NFL. The receiver must control the ball "through the catch". Whether the player is in bounds or out of bounds, the rule is the same. If the player catches the ball and goes to the ground, he must maintain control of the ball until the catch is completed. That is a judgement call by the official, but if the ball is knocked loose by going to the ground, he is not deemed to have maintained control "through the catch".

If a player does not have control of the ball and gains control with any part of his body out of bounds, it is by rule, an incomplete pass.

Last night's call was correct, in my opinion, because the receiver, after initially juggling the ball, gained control, was touched and then the ball was knocked loose by the defender's leg. IMO, even if he hadn't been touched by the defender's hand the call would have been a completed pass, because the act of the defender's leg hitting the receiver's arm is what knocked the ball loose. As soon as that leg touched that arm, the receiver is down by contact.

Down by contact doesn't matter. As soon as the ball crosses the goal line with an offensive player in possession it is a score. Play becomes dead at that point.

[Ravage!!!]

The goal line and the side line are different.

If he has possession of the ball, the micro-second the tip of that ball touches the front end of that goal-line, its a touchdown. Anything after that, doesn't matter. He crossed the goal-line with possession of the ball....


GREAT play by that receiver. To catch and turn in the air and put it across the line.... is EFFING fantastic. One of the best plays of the game.

[BaileyTheBest]

Originally Posted by Ravage!!!

The goal line and the side line are different.

If he has possession of the ball, the micro-second the tip of that ball touches the front end of that goal-line, its a touchdown. Anything after that, doesn't matter. He crossed the goal-line with possession of the ball....


GREAT play by that receiver. To catch and turn in the air and put it across the line.... is EFFING fantastic. One of the best plays of the game.

What about when a player catches the ball in the endzone on the sideline and falls out of bounds and the ball pops out as he hits the ground? I seem to remember passes being called incomplete when that happened. While technically having possession and being over the goal line, I think the WR still has to maintain possession all the way to the ground for it to count.

[Northman]

Originally Posted by BaileyTheBest

What about when a player catches the ball in the endzone on the sideline and falls out of bounds and the ball pops out as he hits the ground? I seem to remember passes being called incomplete when that happened. While technically having possession and being over the goal line, I think the WR still has to maintain possession all the way to the ground for it to count.

Most likely in the cases your talking about the player is never down by contact when going out of bounds so i can see that rule being applied. However, the guy the other night was down by contact with the ball across the goalline.

[BaileyTheBest]

Originally Posted by Northman

Most likely in the cases your talking about the player is never down by contact when going out of bounds so i can see that rule being applied. However, the guy the other night was down by contact with the ball across the goalline.

Ok that makes sense. Thank you.

[spikerman]

Originally Posted by missingnumber7

Down by contact doesn't matter. As soon as the ball crosses the goal line with an offensive player in possession it is a score. Play becomes dead at that point.

Yes and no. If the player already has possession of the ball and crosses the goal line, then it's a score. If ball possession is gained after it crosses the goal line, i.e. the pass is thrown into the end zone or on a play like in the the Super Bowl, the player must maintain possession through the catch for it to count. That's why the Raiders (I think) and others had what looked to be sure touchdowns taken away during the season after their receivers lost control of the ball after initially catching it in the end zone.

[spikerman]

Originally Posted by Ravage!!!

The goal line and the side line are different.

If he has possession of the ball, the micro-second the tip of that ball touches the front end of that goal-line, its a touchdown. Anything after that, doesn't matter. He crossed the goal-line with possession of the ball....


GREAT play by that receiver. To catch and turn in the air and put it across the line.... is EFFING fantastic. One of the best plays of the game.

You're right, but since that ball was across the line when he gained control of it he still had to complete the catch - which he did when he was down by contact. Had he dropped the ball when he hit the ground with no contact, imo, it would have been an incomplete pass. If he already had possession and was diving for the end zone as soon as the tip crossed the goal line you have a score.

Think of it this way. If a receiver catches the ball in the air in the end zone and is knocked out of bounds before he comes down with the ball it is an incomplete pass - even though the ball crossed the goal line and is in possession of an offensive player. The problem would be that the player did not complete the catch. It's a subtle thing and I think the right call was made in this case.

[spikerman]

Originally Posted by BaileyTheBest

What about when a player catches the ball in the endzone on the sideline and falls out of bounds and the ball pops out as he hits the ground? I seem to remember passes being called incomplete when that happened. While technically having possession and being over the goal line, I think the WR still has to maintain possession all the way to the ground for it to count.

That's correct.

[spikerman]

Originally Posted by Northman

Most likely in the cases your talking about the player is never down by contact when going out of bounds so i can see that rule being applied. However, the guy the other night was down by contact with the ball across the goalline.

And that's the key.